This is Chris using Abbye's account...

Honestly the reason why I decided to cancel the tournament is because of you Allan.

After reading over the tournament rules and conditions you decided to text me EVERY last thing that was wrong with the tournament. This was our decision to hold the tournament in this fashion and this was our decision to give back to the community. I was looking forward to holding this tournament to get together with my friends and to have fun, but you ruined it for me and Abbye.

You don't get it Allan, I told you that this was a fun tournament, nothing serious. Abbye and I just wanted to give back to Bill and give to the community, but you had to make this something WAY more serious than it should've been. You took the fun out of this for Abbye and I, LOOSEN THE FUCK UP. If you didn't like it, you didn't have to play in it.

Why the fuck would we consult you? We aren't children Allan, we are adults and we make our own decisions. We posted to earlier without consulting you, haha, are you serious about that? You jumped to WAY to many conclusions before you found out about anything..
You jumped down my throat specifically, and for what reason? You don't fucking own us, and you didn't own this fucking tournament. Who the fuck cares if we've never played or hosted one of these tournaments? This is how we wanted to do things and you should've just kept your mouth shut and let us learn from our own mistakes...

What is wrong with Gift Cards? What is wrong with what we wanted to do? Why do you always insist on taking the fun out of things?

Allan, you are our longest mutual friend that we've ever had, but you treat us like shit SO often, I don't get it... We've been nothing but good to you, and honestly I don't know why we've put up with your INSUFFERABLE attitude for this long.

I know you've had this done to you by Amber and KevinDDR, but you didn't have to do this to us. We were friends, we are supposed to support each other, not rip everything to shreds. It is one thing to suggest and give advice, but to feel that you have this entitlement to impede in every aspect of this tournament if very selfish and just plain RUDE. We would never do this to you...

Stop acting like a self righteous prick and attempt for ONCE in your miserable life to have fun with your friends.

Know what, go ahead, keep doing what you do cause all you are doing is pushing people away.

You were worrying about something that wasn't in your control in the first place.

If you want to run a tournament with the seeding song played in advance, but don't want to have to wait until the day of the tournament to find out how many people are actually going to participate (since they'll want to wait and be sure to submit their best score), you could either:

* Have a deadline a week or two before the tournament, and require the seeding scores to be submitted by then.

OR

* Collect entry fees in advance.

The first one is probably easier, though the second one forces people to commit.


It sounded like that was a contributing factor, unless it was just cover to avoid having to bring up the Gerrak drama.

Thanks Nykkel, I appreciate the feed back! We learn some, we gain some! Probably should've put a deadline in, but perhaps that's for another time.

Honestly, if you all saw what Gerrak texted me and what he PM'd Abbye, you'd all be surprised... it was degrading, and uncalled for. We were friends, or so I thought, and friends don't tear each other down, we are supposed to lift each other up. Yeah, there were some mistakes in our rulings and in our decisions for the tournament, but that was the mistakes we could've learned from. Instead, we got an ear full from Allan, and that took the fun out of this entire tournament.

As I mentioned prior, this was for fun, to enjoy our friends company, and to give back to Bill who has been so generous to me and Abbye.

If Allan was the only reason, why not just ban the bad apple from entering the tournament and move on with the rest of it so everyone else could still enjoy it and have fun, instead of cancelling the fun for everyone else?

You sure you don't mean "you've done this to Amber and KevinDDR"? I'm not a fan of posting PMs in public but maybe I should point out that Gerrak did this exact same thing 3 years ago when I decided to run a tournament. If you want more details you can ask me about it. I'm sad to see that another event organizer feels that they have to bend to his abusive behavior.

Allan had told us that you and Amber have over thrown his tournament. I apologize for speaking without understanding the full story, I was just stating what I've heard from Allan.

Let me explain our decision to cancel the tournament.

Both Abbye and I were looking forward to running this tournament to give people the opportunity to compete and to enjoy each others company. After all that transpired, our hearts fell out of wanting to run the tournament. We decided to cancel to get away from all of this, we decided that it truly wasn't worth our effort and our time. We feel as though the PNW community wasn't a place for us to begin with, and with that, we should remove ourselves from it. This tournament was our last effort in trying to integrate ourselves, but as fate would have it, we could not. It is what it is, and there is nothing more to this than what's been already said.

I should probably mention that this happens to me every single time I run a tournament, as well as most of the time when I do anything else. This is a huge problem in the community, has been since the day anyone ever decided to start running ITG tournaments, and for what it's worth, I'm really sorry you guys had to go through it.

@KevinDDR and DJ Yoshi

Thank you for those who've reached out to Abbye and I, it means a lot.

There is just to much of this for me personally, hence my absence in the community. I've been trying to slowly remove myself from ITG...

It is deeply troubling for me, when those who you consider friends lash out at you because of ITG. ITG is not worth it for me...

KevinDDR and Laura, you both do not deserve the way Allan has treated you, nor do I deserve this kind of treatment, especially from someone I considered a friend.

Also, not to add to the drama, but just so you know, I had to ban Allan for a week because he egregiously broke the rules in the bracket voting thread, so he won't be replying here for at least a week (in case you're wondering where he is.)

Allan isn't worth the trouble...

"There is more to life than arrows"
Whoa, that's some sigworthy profundity!

Noo! Chris & Abbye! Don't leave! The community might stress on you, (after all what tightly knit community doesnt from time to time?) but please don't quit.

I get that real life stuff comes up, so you both take care of that and come back to ITG when ready! I personally am forever grateful for what you have done to the Narrows machine, and the people that are now coming there to play! It's been a great time since the new machine has been put in, and everyone who has been there has been having a great time.

Ultimately it's your decision on what to do, and I'll respect it either way because again, it's your decision and your lives, but I really hope to see you both around Narrows (especially on Friday nights for some arrow smashing ). And, if you choose to, sometime later on host another tournament, you better bet i'll be there!

Take care both of you!
-Nick

Off topic, but the computer is in an error at Narrows right now.  And of course on a custom system, our guys are not sure what to do.

Oh. Guess I'll be there tomorrow morning to work on it!

I fixed the issue, and hopefully prevented it from ever happening again. Yay!

So, hey everyone.

Wait do what now

Hi Amber =)

Soo..... Erm.... I dunno if this is the right place to post this (new forum netiquette is always a rough one for me :p) but when is there going to be another tourney? I may be able to make it out this December and I'm pining for some machine assisted dancing (after all, who wants to dance without a bar hahah)!

Yeah!

If you weren't able to host a tournament yesterday, that's totally fine.
I hope that given enough time, you guys can pull it off! People do want to enter the tournament, it's just that they would wait at the last minute to post their scores, and it may discouragingly seem that they didn't want to enter, but they do.

Please try again. You can make it work.
The tournament should be for fun anyway. It's what you can do to gather everyone in the community together.

FYI, yesterday afternoon, the machine showed ITG as being locked, could not get the game running.

ITG was running this morning, thanks to who fixed it.

I chuckled, because typically posts like this are from random players TO Bill.  Not Bill to players. 

Hey guys, sorry I broke the rules earlier. I was just skimming the forums at the time and I'd totally forgotten, so my bad! This one is gonna be a long and detailed one, I'm sorry:


Now I don't really want to rehash this, but I need to make a few things clear now that I'm able... This side of the story is for everyone to consider, though many things are directed, since I feel like Chris has painted me with many things I think are just outright slanderous lies.

First, I'm very sorry if I was too pushy with you guys, Chris. I was not going to even go to the tournament; my offer to run it was supposed to be a gesture of my support and trying to not have, and BlueSS nicely put it, it ruined for everyone, as you had stated earlier that you were cancelling due to lack of attendance. I hadn't even talked to you in some time before you cancelled it, to me seemingly out of the blue... Communication over text can be difficult, and since we started our disagreements back when you threatened to get us all kicked out of Acme, you have refused to talk to me in any personal capacity over the phone or in person as a real friend would if their friendship mattered at all to them. I argue and analyze as my entire profession, and yes, my writing about things like tournaments is very analytic and scrutinizing, but it is not just a rant, nor anything in anger at all.

I have never, even during that Acme disagreement, been angry with you, or cussed you out, or called you names. I'm sorry if you interpret what I've said as "tearing you to shreds" or condescending, or overly assertive, but I was just trying to help you guys to not miss the most basic things... You say people would be surprised what I said to you, but I would have anyone here read our conversations; I've said nothing but firm analysis of holes in the rules, and why they are problems, and how to fix them. No anger ever, no names thrown, or anything of the sort. You are the only one angry, and I still care so much about you guys and would have you as a friend were you not so hurtful back to me... I don't deserve to be called "miserable" or a "self righteous prick" or any of those things, I just tried to help you even though I wasn't even going to go... I've certainly never called you guys things like that, and I've certainly never lied about you (especially in public here), and I've never refused to have an actual personal conversation with a friend to work out issues, and it's really hurtful to have that done to me by people I really care about.

Now, probably I should have let you guys make more mistakes of your own, but you guys didn't even know how a bracket works, didn't have seeding at all, then didn't know how to do it at all, didn't have any rules on difficulties, didn't have a miss recalculation policy, among many other things. While you guys seem to want to make it about you and your tournament, this was intended by you as a community event everyone was supposed to enjoy. I was asserting myself into the process, yes, because I knew you guys had never even competed before and really didn't know what you were doing at all, and I know for a fact that that would have resulted in huge problems day-of.



NOW, this brings me to Kevin and Amber's story. You have completely misrepresented the story I told you about them. I told you that they took over for me (NOT "Hijacked", "Overthrown", etc.) running the first tournament I tried to run because I had no experience and didn't know what I was doing at all, exactly like you. Amber asked me if she could take over and told me why, and I agreed it was the best thing. I told you in retrospect I think more than ever they were completely in the right to do so. I also told you you didn't need anyone to take over for you, however, but you needed to really consider what I brought up and change some things up because they were really big issues that were absolutely going to screw people over.

Regarding the tournament 3(? Not sure if this is right, maybe 4) years ago, Kevin, I believe I must have argued with you, definitely wrongfully, about out of state players. At the time, I did not like that out of state players had won all of our tournaments for several years, so I pushed for an in-state only tournament with round-robin at the end to just be between the best people at the time. In retrospect, this was totally misguided and unreasonable, and I would never push for such a thing now since out of state players are totally awesome to have come here, and I probably pushed hard for other things like the round-robin. I also was even more hotheaded back then, and especially prone to getting more negatively emotional over things, so I can recall things getting heated at times. I am so sorry for how I approached this years ago, and I'm sorry if you still hold ill-feelings about this event or the way I've approached things; I assure you this circumstance with Chris was more like the tournament Kevbo won 5 or so years ago where you took over. I also assure you I'm just trying to scrutinize the rules to eliminate loopholes and such and make it more fun day-of.


So look, I really care about all of you guys, and I really care about my friendships in particular with the people I've addressed above. I want to be able to work things out, and I'm willing to have a real, personal conversation with you or anyone I've made upset or wronged. I really want Chris and Abbye to keep running tournaments also, though maybe even go just attend one first as I've encouraged for years, and I especially appreciate their involvement in the community! I think it's really important, but I don't see why things have to be taken so personally. Chris, when your privileges to work on the Acme machine were removed by Acme, none of us had to do with it, but you seemed to blame Laura and Tony, and got so angry and vengeful with me when I tried to keep you from going to Acme management and getting us all kicked out like they were about to. I had 'bigger fish to fry' than your pride; all of us were going to get kicked out and you were getting upset about just not being able to work on the pads. The same thing here, I was trying to keep a lot of people from getting screwed over. You still won't play at Acme out of some pride and anger issue, and we miss you terribly there... You're always welcome of course.



Regardless, rest assured I'll certainly not be getting really involved anymore; there's no need to worry about me anyway. I've barely played in months and I won't really be able to much going forward. I'm finishing my Master's degree this year and then doing more school after, so I don't have time for this forum or ITG stuff anymore.

In closing, please all of you understand that I did not ever berate or sling insults at any time to Chris during our conversations. If what I said sounded overly critical or condescending, it was unintentional, as I'm just trying to be (perhaps overly) protective, and I don't have much time, so things might unintentionally come on strong and be more intense a tone than I'm really writing with on the other end. Additionally, the story about Kevin and Amber was completely misrepresented, as it sounded like I was painting them negatively when in fact I was completely agreeing with them and painting them positively.

I hope you guys keep having tournaments. Honestly this overwhelming backfiring of my good intention and then getting slammed with insults and lied about in front of everyone has finally burnt me out on this mess. I might go from time to time but I'm going to cease more of what little involvement I've had left... I'm also not going to do achievements any more because I did all that mostly for people like Chris and Abbye to get engaged, which they did and loved up until they decided I'm a "miserable condescending prick," and I don't have time for it anymore. Anyway these kinds of insults and misrepresentations about what I've said needed to be addressed. I hope to not have to write such a long post as this ever again on these forums...

Thanks so much all for your consideration of my side of the story.

Allan

Allan...

Ooh, Somebody Loves You